That little bump just behind the wings and legs the area called the thorax. Some flies use this to enhance the body of the fly to make for a more realistic appearance to the fly. Some of the materials used for the thorax are hares mask, and natural squirrel as well as many more natural and synthetic blends. For me it's pretty much one of the three pictured above.
Now I can't say whether or not it will make a whole lot of difference to the trout but to my eye I have a definite preference for a thorax. In some of the spider's tied below you can see some with and some without a thorax.
Hares mask thorax.
Dyed natural squirrel thorax.
Natural fox squirrel thorax.
Spider with no thorax.
These next two spiders, sulphurs both...the first is tied with out a thorax and the second one is with a thorax.
Now many of these spider pattern can be tied with a heavily dubbed thorax, or as I like them tied on the sparse side.
I am not sure the trout care either way, with or without a thorax. Probably both versions would entice hits. What matters to me in flies is what version gives confidence to me that when I drift a fly that I have given myself the best chance to get a hit. All of those soft hackle spiders are gems and I would have confidence in all of them.
ReplyDeleteParachute Adams
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Sam a flies ability to produce fish has a great deal to do with how much time it spends in the water...and that time is given by the angler who has faith in it.
I vote for the thorax.... as I think it gives the fly a better shape when it's wet and promotes better movement and support of the hackle. In the water, I think the fly without a thorax can end up with the hackle plastered against the hook shank and looking like Twiggy vs. Raquel Welch... then again, the fish only get a couple of seconds to look at it before they need to decide to eat it...or not.. So, I guess we need to fish them both to find out... if we have to, we have to. Have fun!
ReplyDeleteDoug Korn, Fly Tyer
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Doug support is a feature that I like a thorax for. Some of those hen hackles can be quite whimpy and need the help to make them stand out.
Exactly...
DeleteThorax for me most times. Very nice patterns by the way.
ReplyDeleteRalph Long
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Ralph seems like the thorax is the way to go so far.
Thorax for me, every time. I make them a big larger than necessary and dub loosely so that the fibers pull out and add a layer of action and texture.
ReplyDeleteRM Lytle
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Rowan on some flies I'll dub heavy, but mostly it's on the sparse side. You are correct in the statement those loose fibers add movement that does not go unnoticed. Spiky natural squirrel is awesome.
As I see it Allen, the most important feature of the dubbed thorax is that it may and likely does capture mini air bubbles (air shot). The air shot, trapped within the dubbing acts like little lenses under water, reflecting and refracting incident light. This effect has a major influence on the trout's response as Ed Hewitt pointed out, long ago. Dos centavos mia.
ReplyDeleteJohn Dornik
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John, good point. I did a water test of various soft-hackles. In the water they did exactly as you state. These air bubbles that were trapped, some alone and some multiple grabbed that light and made a bright shiny spot that I know would enhance the flies effectiveness.
John today is National Soup Day, how about some "kapusta"?
Thorax for me to. Generally improving the profile, some spiders though always dressed slim. Waterhen bloa always nice and skinny.
ReplyDeleteBecks and Brown Trout North Yorkshire
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Andy I'm in agreement with the sparseness of the spider. I like to use some rather long fibers in my dubbing with the thought that it's adds that subtle movement that is so deadly, yet it maintains the overall sparse look of the spider.
I appreciate your Yorkshire input.
I'm with you. I will tie "needles" and have been doing so exclusively using the CDC style soft-hackles I first read about here on your blog.
ReplyDeleteLovely ties.
However, given a choice I will include a herl thorax on whatever spider I am tying for the top 8" - 12" layer. these seem to cover all manner of glistening shimmer the trout see from emerging insects. Helps my confidence in fishing them, anyway. That's a key for sure.
spike
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I like the reference "needles"....
Peacock is a great material for the thorax, it is known as a trout killer, that term is for a lack of a better word at this time.
Confidence in a fly will make for some special days.
Nice tyings with & without Alan, I personally prefer using both & Ive often tied up same pattern with & without and its amazing what the results are fishing them side by side.
ReplyDeleteregards
George
George
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George I must try the side by side method. Come the warmer weather I'll have a full plate.
Alan
ReplyDeleteI have tied some with and without thorax, both work for me. As long as they catch fish!! Your flies above are the usual works of art.
TROUT1
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Pete you are a master at fishing these flies, so if it's a fifty fifty I can live with that.
Have you tried woodchuck? ;)
ReplyDeleteHoward Levett
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Howard do you mean using woodchuck for the thorax?
I vote for thorax, I like the profile when a thorax is used. I also like a thorax that has material that moves, such as hares ear. I think all my soft hackles have it. That's not to say they wouldn't work without it. I agree with parachute Adams ,confidence plays a major factor with me. Nice post, thankyou
ReplyDeleteBrad Basehore
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Brad your thoughts are very much the same as others.
I know that the sparseness of a thorax will produce a nice subtle movement to the fly. I need to do a bit of on stream research.
Not sure it matters, though the last couple years I've been a thorax guy - just like how it looks :)...
ReplyDeleteHibernation
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Will on some flies they just look right with a thorax. But spiders if it is used it should be very sparse.
The thorax always appealed to my eye and the trout seem to like it too. I almost always use a judicious amount of thorax, typically hare's ear.
ReplyDeleteNJpatbee
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Pat here's ear is a fine natural material. Lately I find myself reaching for squirrel dub I like the spikiness.
I'm a fan of both just looking at your photographs. I don't fish flies like that, but I can see where they would both have their application, and if I were to have the two different types in my fly box, I would probably go with the ones with the thorax, but like you, I don't think the fish really care all that much about that small difference.
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